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September 14, 2003
Why Interviews are Like Finals
A list of five...
5. For all the preparation you do, the result will depend entirely on your game-day performance.
4. They're both completely subjective.
3. The outcome is determined by the whim of somebody else. (Yes, this is simlar to #4, but not identical.)
2. The time surrounding interviews brings out the worst in law students, just like finals.
1. Unless it went terribly, you really have no idea what the outcome will be.
The last one has been on my mind a lot.
Of 19 screening interviews during OCI, I had only one that went outright poorly. By the time it was over, I knew that I didn't want to work for them, and I had very very little doubt that they didn't want me to work for them. I can't quite explain where it went wrong, but the outcome was clear by the time I said the biggest thing that attracted me to the firm was the training program, and the attorneys both responded that the training program was essentially a joke.
Most interviews aren't like that. By and large, most of my interviews were very pleasant. We had good conversations covering a broad range of things. A few of my interviews seemed outstanding. In those interviews, we really hit it off. We talked about all sorts of things not related to law, but didn't fall into the "friendly interview" trap that leaves the interviewer with nothing substantive on which to base an evaluation. Career Services warned us about that type of interview, so I tried to avoid it. In these few exceptional interviews, we talked about everything from legal interests, job experience and long-term career goals to my interests in BBQ and baking. They knew that I was a chill guy that they'd want to have a beer with after work, but they knew that when it came to doing the work, I would rock their world. I was perfect.
And I got dinged. That happened twice with firms that were among my top choices.
Those were my "A" interviews, but I got "F" results. Some of my interviews that lacked the personality and exuberance ended up better. These were the ones where I came out thinking, "Hmm.... That didn't go great, but it was still pretty good. Maybe I'll get lucky." I felt like those were "B" interviews, but some of them yielded "A" results.
This makes it difficult to prepare for callbacks, because I can't quite figure out what went right and what went wrong. I know the big dos and dont's, but it's the finer points where I'm coming up blank. Just like exams.
Posted by buddha at September 14, 2003 03:22 PM
Comments
It's all a mystery.
What may have happened with the "A" interview/"F" result is that the screening interviewer liked you and was impressed with you, but the rest of the hiring committee (for whatever reason, including no reason at all) decided not to invite you back for a callback.
Similarly, the "B" interview/"A" result may be due to the fact that hiring committee liked you a lot on paper and so long as you passed the "drool" test, you were going to get a callback. You didn't have to hit a home run; you just had to avoid striking out, and as it turns out, you got a base hit. Good enough.
It hurts and even though I'm several years removed from the law firm hiring (though just two years removed from the teaching interview), I still remember what it was like. It's not easy, but it sounds like you'll be fine, especially as you've got a number of callbacks as it is. Just try not to dwell on the whys of the process, and just concentrate on the law firms who are interested in you.
Good luck!
Posted by: Tung Yin at September 15, 2003 08:38 PM
My girlfriend just went through OCI and, after seeing which firms gave her callbacks after which interviews, it boggles my mind how strange the process is. She had a callback with a firm on Friday and came home a little sad because she thought it went horribly. Then, she got an offer from them today.
It's all madness, this law school thing.
Posted by: Adam at September 15, 2003 09:14 PM
Thanks for the encouragement.
When I first found myself with a small handful of callbacks, I told a few good friends to remind me how good I had it when, down the line, I started to complain or worry.
try not to dwell on the whys of the process
Possibly the best OCI-related advice I've heard yet.
Posted by: buddha at September 15, 2003 09:36 PM
If I may speak from outside the loop, it sounds like OCI interviews are pretty much like any other interviews, except that the enourmous stakes and compressed timing of the whole thing bring the whole out all of the details.
How many times have you walked out of an interview and not known how it went? Or later found out that your gut feel way completely wrong. Now you've got that same thing with the much higher stakes and the fact that you have several interviews of varying levels of quality to compare it with. Gives you a lot to think too much about.
Posted by: chocobo puduu at September 16, 2003 09:57 AM
No doubt the compressed nature and high stakes of the game make a difference. But they're both central parts of the process/problem, so it's sort of tough to take them out of the picture when talking about OCI and getting a job from law school.
Posted by: buddha at September 16, 2003 10:56 AM
Of course. I was just saying that the uncertainty is is the same. It just feels worse because of the environment. Just like a coin flip has the same uncertainty but feels different when it's over who sits shotgun vs. whether or not to confront your boss, these interviews are mostly the same as any other as far as the uncertainty goes. It's just that you have a lot more to be uncertain about.
Posted by: Anonymous at September 16, 2003 11:23 AM
Also, the bit about knowing the big dos and donts but not knowing the finer points is extremely observant and relevant to many other things. So good writing on that.
And good luck with the next round
Posted by: chocobo puduu at September 16, 2003 11:25 AM
Jubu, we're living parallel lives right now...I couldn't agree more with your entire post.
Posted by: JCA at September 16, 2003 07:59 PM
Sadly, we law students are not unique and special butterflies. I know a lot of my friends are feeling the same, and I'd guess that's true everywhere. But I think the others who commented here had some good perspectives.
Posted by: buddha at September 17, 2003 01:10 AM
Actually, I think interviews are closer to dates than finals. I've had some dates that went great, and then....nada. Never could figure it out. Just like the girl I dated for the first half of last year. One week, she's asking me to meet her parents, the next she's dumping me. Figure that out, and you'll figure out why an interview that seemingly goes great results in a rejection letter.
Good luck to you, though. And a good suggestion about dropping off a resume. Now I just need to figure out how to do it, and, of course, dress better when I show up for class.
Just a curiousity - were you wearing a suit when you pulled that same-day thing off, or did you have to zip home to change?
Posted by: greg at September 19, 2003 05:38 PM
I was wearing a suit, because it was during OCI. At my school, there are way more firms doing interviews than any one person can get a chance to talk to. So if there was a firm I was interested in, but that I didn't get an interview with through the lottery system, I would stop by their room when they had a break in the interview schedule, or swing by their "hospitality suite" if it was a bigger firm, introduce myself, and drop off my resume.
From what I can tell, the firms aren't huge fans of the lottery system, since it can prevent them from meeting good candidates. Dropping off an extra resume for them gives them one more person to consider, and you look good for showing some initiative.
I picked up an interview today at a regional job fair this way. It would have been two, but the last attorney couldn't see me until after my only ride wanted to leave.
Posted by: buddha at September 20, 2003 02:54 AM
I feel like you read my mind, right down to the number of interviews. I think the interviews are exactly like exams, and I think both are entirely unique to law school. Prior to law school I always knew if interviews and exams went well. Now I'm nearly always wrong. Sometimes that's good, sometimes it's bad, but it is certainly disconcerting. Good luck.
Posted by: OSU Girl at September 20, 2003 04:10 PM